Hillman refers to soul as “a perspective rather than a substance, a viewpoint toward things rather than a thing itself”. The value of seeing beneath, between, and beyond to achieve new perspectives for learning, integration, transformation, and growth was a personal challenge for Hillman, who claimed depth psychology can be summed up in one excerpt from Heraclitus: “You could not discover the limits of the soul (psyche), even if you traveled every road to do so; such is the depth...of its meaning."Recorded live at The Summit On Ethics and Meaning in 1995 Washington DC.